Microsoft does a major reorganization deemphasizing the operating system and Vanderbilt shows off NLP/AI for navigating the EHR. Could this signal a change in computing paradigms? How to grow the number of women in Health IT leadership roles.

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Bill Russell:                   00:01               Hey podcast listeners, thanks for listening. If you’re enjoying this week in health it, we just wanted to give you some information on how you can support these conversations to keep them going this weekend. Health. Its goal is to keep you your organization and your employees updated with the emerging thought and trends in the healthcare industry. Through our conversations with healthcare and technology leaders, the best and easiest way you can show your support is to go over to this week in health it on itunes and leave us a review. Also, you can subscribe on Itunes, Google play, or stitcher, or go over to our youtube page and subscribe and hit the notification bell. Again, we really appreciate you spending your valuable time listening to this podcast.

Bill Russell:                   00:52               welcome to this week in health it where we discussed the news information and emerging thought with leaders from across the healthcare industry. This is episode number 13. It’s Friday, April sixth, today to Satya Nadella knows something that we don’t Microsoft as a major reorg away from their windows operating system group. Does that mean anything for health? It will also take a look at an article about what physicians can do about the rising cost of healthcare, and we all were going to also talk about women in health it leadership roles. This podcast is brought to you by health lyrics, so leader and moving healthcare to the cloud. To learn more, check out [inaudible] dot com. My name is Bill Russell, recovering healthcare cio, writer and consultant with the previously mentioned health lyrics. Today I’m joined by a friend of a friend and someone that has an, has had an impressive cio career Sushi and recommended that I reach out to her as a guest for her leadership, but it really was a child presentation that I attended where I made the decision that I had to have Jamie on the show in that presentation about digital transformation. She shared a strategy for getting buy in that was powerful and yet fairly simple. Uh, but before we get there today, I’m excited to have Jamie Nelson, the cio of the hospital for specialty surgery. Join us. Good Morning Jamie, and welcome to the show.

Jamie Nelson:               02:09               Good Morning Bill. How are you?

Bill Russell:                   02:11               Good. So do you, that chime presentation this past year, uh, you were talking about the need to improve the intake process for, uh, for surgery and you had a whole bunch of different technology tools that you’re using and what you decided to do. Um, or at least what I remember from the talk is you brought the team and the executive team, the people responsible for it and you said, okay, you’re going to go through the process with the tools we have today for this and you know, and then we’ll just talk about it when we’re done. And when they were done, you had complete buy in that the process was a little convoluted and needed to change. Do you, can you tell us a little bit about that process?

Jamie Nelson:               02:51               We had so many tools. We had different ways of collecting data. We had portals, we had paper, we had research assistants, we registrars, nurses. We had just a wide variety of things and it really was not patient focused. Um, and what’s really neat is that bringing our leaders together, many of us have been patients here at Orthopedic Hospital. We all need something done, so understanding from the patient experience was really easy for our leaders and we realized the necessity either simplify, standardize and be really customer focused and that’s easy to say, hard to do because we all want our data, but we’re on that path. Making some progress.

Bill Russell:                   03:31               Yeah. And you’re in New York City, so you definitely have a lot of competition. I’m actually, before I get to your bio, can you tell us a little bit about the hospital for specialty surgery? Said no, please. So tell us, tell us more about it. It’s not a household name, although you, you do, um, you do sponsor the mets. So we’re going to see it more and more if we were baseball fans. So tell us a little bit about, about your institution and what you guys do.

Jamie Nelson:               03:58               Sure. So hospital for special surgery, 156 years now and we are totally orthopedics and musculoskeletal medicine. So that’s rheumatology as well. And we’ve been ranked number one by US News and world reports for orthopedics for seven years running. We’re a magnet hospital so we really do fantastic work here. And we have patients from all 50 states worldwide. People come here for very specialized orthopedic care and we’re proud of our results.

Bill Russell:                   04:30               Yeah. And I apologize for saying that wrong hospital for special surgery. There we go. So here’s your, here’s your bios. A great bio. I’ll go in reverse order here. The you, uh, two ivy league degrees, University of Penn and Cornell Mba and voted a well actually. And then you have the consulting credentials, any first consulting group, you have a great health care background, Memorial Sloan Kettering, New York presby. And uh, obviously where you’re at now as the cio, you were named as one of the most powerful women in health it in 2017 by health data management. You, um, you have adjusted your organization to the changing needs within healthcare. You’ve created an organization that now has a Cmio, a CTO, CSO, vp of applications, a VP of business intelligence, data analytics. So you’re seeing the trends as they’re happening and adapting to those. And uh, the, the thing, we all went on our resume, top six percent of a successful Emr implementations that epic has highlighted for you guys. And Hims level seven. So these are, these are definitely some, uh, accomplishments that, uh, other ceos can be jealous of

Jamie Nelson:               05:41               or I did not mention one other accomplishment. I am the mother of three.

Bill Russell:                   05:47               It didn’t, it didn’t make it on the bio when your kids are going to be. One of the things we do with each one of our guests is we asked them to give us an idea of what they’re currently working on, that they’re either something they’re working on or something they’re excited about that they want to talk about.

Jamie Nelson:               06:05               Going back to the presentation. China certainly on our digital journey and we’re doing things like streamlining the front end, adding patient photos, adaptation, texting a self online scheduling and those things sounds so fundamental. But in healthcare we’re not there yet. You’d have all that banking but you don’t have that in healthcare. So we’re working on that. Analytics is the huge push. Where we do is all the data we’re collecting and how are we going to use it. And then finally, telemedicine is just popping up all over the place. Every week there’s another request across our desk to provide telemedicine. So lots of interesting technology based initiatives going on.

Bill Russell:                   06:44               Yeah. So your reaches is a New York City obviously, but you’re, you’re expanding outside of New York City as well, aren’t you?

Jamie Nelson:               06:51               Yes. We, many of our patients come from outside our area and we know that every one, except for people who come from the upper east side, Manhattan have to pass some other very fine orthopedics department in a fine hospital to get to us. So we really focused on patient experience outcomes, letting people know why we need to come here with the value is coming to hss. So yeah, we’re, as I mentioned earlier, we’re all 50 states trying to stay strong and international.

Bill Russell:                   07:25               Yeah. And so the, the followup, obviously the followup with telehealth and whatnot becomes, uh, becomes key and even presurgery becomes key as well. Absolutely. So here’s how, here’s how the show works. We use a story for the first segment a to discuss and uh, you know, so I’ll start us off this. Um, this is over the last week and a half or so, uh, Microsoft as reshuffled the, the corporate deck as it grapples with a world where pc does not dominate. That’s the headline from the La Times story. And read a couple things from here. Microsoft, a chief exact Satya Nadella unveiled the company’s biggest reorg in three years, combining the divisions that focus on devices and software for business, for, for businesses while moving the Windows operating system unit into the cloud operations. He also created an inexperienced experiences and devices team. This group will focus on how people interact with various computing devices using multiple senses.

Bill Russell:                   08:26               A Microsoft said in the memo. I’m going to combine that with another story. Um, and the other story is vanderbilt creates ai and natural language processing, voice assistant courts, epic Ehr. Now we knew this was coming, but it’s exciting to see that it’s finally here. So here’s a couple of quotes from this thing that the, uh, the idea to develop an inhouse voice assistant team from the general frustration we heard from the users about the difficulty navigating the Ehr to find relevant information said Yah. Uh, Dr Kuma, crystal Eastar core design advisor, assistant professor of Biomedical Informatics and Assistant Professor of pediatrics, pediatric endocrinology at Vanderbilt University Medical Center and Monro Terrell junior children’s hospital at Vanderbilt. And went on to say there’s a lot of information foraging that occurs in the EHR, although users often know the precise pieces of data they need to understand the clinical picture. So, you know, it’s interesting, the reason I combine these two things is I believe that there’s a change going on in what, uh, we may be focused on within health it and it’s, and, and you sort of touched on it and it’s really around the user experience with the internal user and the external customer user.

Bill Russell:                   09:44               And I guess my question is we have, we have Microsoft saying the Microsoft Windows operating system, you unit no longer exists and has gotten broken up. And so that’s where a lot of our focus was maybe for the last five years, windows upgrades and we had teams and running around doing those kinds of things. And we have the vanderbilt creating ai to interact with the EHR. I guess, I guess my question to you is, are we at a point where every new technology we are bringing in to the hospital that we need to start looking beyond the traditional pc keyboard interaction and, and look to, uh, to the next generation of machine human interaction? Are we, are we at that point finally?

Jamie Nelson:               10:23               I think for physicians we have to give them some sort of assistance with electronic medical record in front of them, but the user interface, the physician burnout that’s created by constantly having to tight is just overwhelming. So I think in these virtual assistants, um, and using artificial intelligence to help formulate that is really brilliant because they’re going to stop using those records. They’re not finding value and we need to create an environment that they can use these tools because there is a tremendous amount of value of the data that we can harvest out of that in terms of improving care. So I think that what they’re doing is just brilliant. And Microsoft, you know, doesn’t want to be the next Kodak, so they have to move. They have to move with where the technology is or push us and again, they’re looking at the cloud. They’re Asia platform. It was very, very popular and I think from use cases, analytics and the cloud are, are just natural partners and that’s a, I think for many of us looking at cloud computing, that’s a great first step. What kind of analytics can we not do on campus? Do you want to put up in the cloud just to test the waters and then maybe move in that direction. So I think they’re doing very smart, very smart steps here.

Bill Russell:                   11:41               Yeah, I remember when Bill Gates are old enough, you can see my gray hair. The delegation was talking about for information at your fingertips and uh, it’s really not at your fingertips anymore. It’s really at your, at your works. And we’re seeing that with TVS. We can now change channels and do stuff with tvs. We can do that with music obviously with news podcasts, you name it on Alexa. And it seems like now what we’re saying is there’s a ton of information behind that front door of the EHR that we can get to with our voice to say, give me the most recent vitals, give me a, you know, the, the information about the most recent, uh, uh, image or those kinds of things. Uh, you know, you, you have been able to adapt. So you’ve created all those roles that we talked about earlier. What are the next couple of roles that you think might, we might be seeing within health it if the keyboard mouse operating system paradigm starts to shift to a more of a voice interaction and those kinds of things. Are we going to see more? Uh, we’ve already seen some more chief digital officer. So are we going to see more chief experience officers? Are we going to start to partner with maybe I’m a digital agencies that are going to come in and really start to, to, to look at how we interact with the machines are or what you, what do you think the next role that we should prepare for it? It is.

Jamie Nelson:               13:08               Well, one thing that we’re doing is for the patient piece is really coordinating with our marketing department because they’re the ones that know that digital patient experience and make it more like a shopping experience. Something that we’re all used to for other industries. In terms of clinicians, I think you need to make sure that whatever you’re doing technologically, that it’s physician led that focus. You can’t build the Emr, put it in front of the clinician and expect them to use it. They have to be part of that process. I think that was one of our reasons we were so successful with epic is that we included our physicians from what we were looking at a system to building it, testing it, implementing it, training. They were with us, so I think that with voice technology and we’re going to have to do the same thing. We have to have. There’s a lead principal back going to where the work is done and having a worker’s bank. Those decisions, physicians or nurse, we really need to involve them as these technologies come forward. Technologies will be easy to find is those physicians who have the time inclination to help us prepare this in a way that’s usable for them, that’s really going to be an important component.

Bill Russell:                   14:18               Yeah, absolutely. And I know that a providence talking with Sarah and Aaron Martin, that they, uh, they, uh, did the same thing around the consumer. They brought in a consumer focus groups and specifically around labor and delivery. They brought in a cohort of women that were, um, that were all along the process and created that they’re a tool for that specific group, uh, with complete input from the that were going through and uh, you know, it really reflected what questions they asked and what they were looking for and we have to continue to do that. And that’s one of the great skills of leading CIS. Alright, so I’m going to take it over to you, unless you have any closing comments, kick it over to you to, to take us to the next story.

Jamie Nelson:               15:10               Uh, one closing comment, I assume you were to, uh, this month or last month, I’m losing track, but voice was really touted as the technology of the teacher. Every session I went to. So that really circles back to what your point was. Well, I picked an article by Dr Rkg that many of us have read stuff with his other works, but it was in the times this week and it was really about doctors being in the driver’s seat of helping to control costs while still making sure the patients get the most effective treatments available to them. And I had just heard a medical futurist or hospitals, you’ve just Joe Flower speak this week on the topic of waste in the system and saying that a third of what we do in healthcare is waste and that’s a huge number and it’s due to overdiagnosis over a testing, overtreatment administrative waste. All the things we know about.

Jamie Nelson:               16:09               But this article really says that the physicians hold the key and understanding which treatments provided the most benefits to patients or convincing patients. So there’s a really interesting statement where he said that there’s this starling dissociation between cost and value. We all things things that have a high price have more worse, you know, and that’s what the shirt you might buy or with the Mri you might buy, you don’t mind spending a thousand dollars. Did you think it has more quality, but that may not always and it’s not always true. So this article really talks about the need to understand through analytics, through different types of analyses, what treatments really are most effective and using those and convincing patients that it’s okay to skip a mammogram if you don’t want to have a certain set of, um, of a family traits or not to get the latest tests because it’s really not necessary from your condition. But that’s, that’s difficult.

Bill Russell:                   17:13               Yeah, it is. It is an actually, um, he uses the example for Atlanta and Plavix, which my father had a similar story. I keep using my parents’ stories, but I guess when your parents get to be 80 some odd years old, that’s, that’s uh, that’s what we talked about. But he had that same thing. And it was interesting to read the article and realized there’s really only a two percent difference in outcomes, but there’s a significant difference in costs and, uh, and, and we experienced that as family. There is a significant difference in cost. And as a, and he talked about the dilemma with Docker, um, that is their job to convince them that the two percent isn’t really necessary so that they can stay within, uh, within budgets and not overspend and how much of this burden that we put on physicians that, uh, uh, it is a really fascinating article.

Bill Russell:                   18:06               I really recommend people to see us in the New York Times magazine, a conductor’s choose between saving lives and saving a fortune. But the one thing I wanted to focus in on with you is there are. So, so you, you talked about the disassociation between cost and value. So there’s three major factors identified by researchers, administrative waste, pharmaceutical costs, and procedural costs may promote familiar sounding solutions to the costs of health care, decreased waste by removing unnecessary and burdensome paperwork, drive down pharmaceutical prices through negotiation on costs, for instance, or by enabling the introduction of generic alternatives for patient expired medicines and limit the use of high cost, low value procedures where possible. I guess my question really focuses around analytics. So you have an analytics team. Most healthcare organizations are, are standing up these, these analytics teams and some are hiring data scientists, uh, are, are you, do you find that physicians want you to focus in on these kinds of things or the administration wants you to focus in on these kinds of things? Um, or are we. Yeah. Yeah. Well let’s go.

Jamie Nelson:               19:17               Is very focused on value. About two years ago, we hired a physician, Dr Katherine would claim to be our chief value officer. And what we’re trying to do is to use data. We have data scientists, we have analytics to try and really understand what the outcomes are of the specific procedures we do here at hss. And talk about the value of what we do and why people should come here for care. Now when people come for second opinions, and I’m forgetting the exact percentage, but somewhere between a quarter and a third, we tell them they don’t need the surgery, that they’re local orthopedic surgeon tells them that they need it. We’re not about coming in. Yep, you’re here. We’re going to, we’re going to operate on. And we really do look at what’s the best value treatment. So we’re trying to put together data that helps us to find that value proposition, um, and, and make sure that the patients are being given the proper treatments for what they did is. So we’re very focused on this and you know, orthopedics has often looked upon as a high cost segment of healthcare, but we want to make sure that the right people are being treated.

Bill Russell:                   20:28               Can you give us an example of maybe some of the analytics? Uh, it was just one of the analytics projects you might be doing that, that would inform, inform the organization or, or help the organization to make better decisions with regard to any area administrative ways, quality, any anything.

Jamie Nelson:               20:49               Uh, let’s talk about, go into a nursing home after you’ve had orthopedic surgery. We have data around which nursing homes have the best outcomes in our area. We are able to see that nursing homes that follow a set of guidelines that we provide for them and have our nurses calling to check on our patients while they’re at nursing homes actually have much better outcomes. So this is not big data analytics. This is something that we can look at in a, in a very controlled environment. And you know, when you start there, you can just imagine with more data and other types of tools, but that’s very simple. So shorter length of stays in nursing homes, less cost to the patient, less cost to the system. And we want patients and we don’t want them in facilities where they don’t have to be. So that’s a great example.

Bill Russell:                   21:39               That is a great example and it is interesting. I think sometimes we make any analytics to be a way too complicated. There’s so much data. I think the hardest thing is to determine what questions we’re going to ask and what, you know, what, what things we’re going to try to solve as well.

Jamie Nelson:               21:56               Learning, uh, you know, turns that whole thing upside down because when you’re using machine learning, often the questions come out of the data, um, because we can’t think of every question, but that’s a, that’s a really exciting prospect of moving forward and using more sophisticated tools as, as we really collect more data.

Bill Russell:                   22:16               Absolutely. So, um, so let’s, let’s kick into our next segment. Our next segment is a leadership protect talk. This week we’re going to explore, uh, the glass ceiling and health it from a story that you wrote on Linkedin. So I’m going to highlight a highlight your story, um, and the story title is lessons learned from shattering the glass ceiling and you really gave us three concepts and I want to talk to you about these three concepts in terms of shattering glass ceiling, increase the pipeline of, um, increased the pipeline, exhorting women to really take risks, uh, and finally to be assertive. So let’s, let’s just go in that order. So let’s talk about the pipeline. What’s the, what’s the makeup? I mean if you have these numbers, what’s the makeup of women in health it today or leadership positions and uh, well, what, what are we doing today to maybe change that makeup or what can we be doing to change that makeup?

Jamie Nelson:               23:18               Sure. Um, I don’t have numbers for you, but I can tell you from my own experience, there are a mini seminar sessions I go to where I am the only female leader I’d see later in the role or just female leader in the room period. And so I think there’s a real gap in terms of women in leadership now, as I wrote in the article at hospital for special surgery, the top ranks are filled with women, um, which I feel very fortunate to be in this institution. But as you look out into it, across the industry, that doesn’t, it’s not really true. Women are a very small percentage and we really need to change that because diversity of thought and diversity of viewpoint really, really makes for a better outcome and that state driven.

Bill Russell:                   24:03               So we have to increase the funnel is essentially the concept. So is it, um, is it, should we get involved? How far down should we get involved? We get involved down into the grade school level colleges. Are there programs we should be, uh, maybe encouraging women to, to, or, or girls really, I mean girls my daughters age to really pick up some of these skills and encouraging them that they, they can actually pursue careers in, in this field.

Jamie Nelson:               24:34               We’re going to solve this one woman at a time. I think we have to get a large Bolus of women who are coming through these stem programs through these technical programs. When you’re the only female in a class of 10 engineering students, it doesn’t feel right and you may not stay there. If there’s four women, six women, then you start to get this wave coming through and I think we need to do that. I, I think once you start to get a larger group and then the pipeline really does start to fill out. I can’t hire a female network engineer there. They’re not coming through the pipeline. They’re not there as much as I would love to. So that’s why we really have to start high school. College. I think that’s the place

Bill Russell:                   25:20               that’s kinda crazy because that’s really true. I just, uh, I just took my daughter on a college trip. In fact, I’m off this week so you can tell with the suit jacket that I’m off this week. We, uh, we visited some colleges and she wants to be in forensic science and abby from ncs has really inspired this next generation, uh, to pursue these kinds of careers. But still when they go around the room and there’s, you know, 40, 50 people in the room and they say who’s interested in these, in these roles, it’s still a majority for the science technology, engineering and it’s still a majority male raising their hands saying that’s the program I want to go into. So there is something culturally that we need to change before, um, before they’re looking at colleges to get them to do that. And I think people enrolls people like yourself, like sue calling and many other female leaders.

Bill Russell:                   26:15               You talked about you’re a CEO. Uh, I was at a health system where Deborah proctor was the CEO. We had our chief strategy officer was female, our chief financial officer was female, so we had an organization that, uh, I think 50 percent of the president’s cabinet was female, 50 percent male. And that diversity of thought, I think really led to a really solid decision making, looking at the entire process and really taking things into account. Not necessarily that women think differently than men, although I think in a lot of cases they do, but they were um, but just having that diversity of thought sparks the conversation. So

Jamie Nelson:               26:56               no, I think it’s okay to stay. We are different. We are different. We were socialized differently. We think differently. That’s okay. Um, I think for many years we didn’t want to admit that there were differences in women’s, just wanted to sort of fit in where they could. And I’ve, I’ve come to think that that’s wrong, that we have identified that there are differences, that those differences are positive and we have to really embrace them and move forward with them.

Bill Russell:                   27:20               Right. So you, you go on. So you say, um, it actually, I find this part to be interesting. You say women need to take more risks and the, how you highlight this as you say, almost, um, you talk about that men are willing to, to jump into the next role even though they know they’re not qualified for it, but they’ll figure it out as they go. Whereas women are more pragmatic and they say, well, no, I’m not ready for roll yet. And they try to get ready for that role before they step into it. Um, so what are you encouraging women to do here in terms of taking risks?

Jamie Nelson:               27:55               You know, when, when women come to talk to me, I tell them, don’t check all 10 boxes are getting checked off, three or four of your qualifications for that next role. Go ahead and try for it because we really hold ourselves back in this way. And I was just saying to a hidden brand new podcast this morning when I was walking my dogs and they were talking about how this happens from when girls were little girls are socialized, be careful, don’t hurt yourself, don’t, you know, don’t run. And when you have that invoice, say go have fun, play, jump up off the tree branch. So that’s, it starts when we’re very young. So that’s how it is. And we have to recognize that and say okay, it’s all right to, to take these risks. So I always encourage women. A few boxes does good, you know, tried that. We were looking at happens if you fail and then you figure something else out, that’s how you grow.

Bill Russell:                   28:48               Yeah, and I, I would think almost anyone, including myself, when I took the cio role, I was not ready for that cio role. Now. I was confident in my skills. I knew I’d be able to figure it out, but first I’d say six months in the role, I was completely overwhelmed trying to learn the, you know, all the things that you need to learn and sometimes you just have to get in that situation to learn the situation and I think that’s what you’re saying. You’re saying, you know, check off a couple of boxes, be confident in your skills and then get out there, see what happens.

Jamie Nelson:               29:19               I would never alone. You know, you try a new situation, you, you’ve built a network, you have people you can call and ask and we have to learn to draw on those things and not worry that beach. Perfect women. Women are socialized to be perfect and that’s another, another issue. We’ve got to get past that. It’s okay to ask for help, try new things, fail, but it’s really okay.

Bill Russell:                   29:42               Yeah. So your last thing is be assertive, maybe assertive, not be aggressive, but you’re saying stand up for yourself. I mean if, if the ideas are yours and you know, make your ideas known and, and those kinds of things. Um, so, uh, so what, what are you saying? Give us more detail on what you’re saying by women should be more assertive.

Jamie Nelson:               30:05               Women have to learn to communicate effectively and that’s where I sit in the art that you’ve really got to look at yourself. What is your communication style like? What type of language are you using? Where’s your toll? Um, where’s your eye contact? Where’s your body language? And if you, if you’re able to communicate in a way that you can be heard, then that’s really going to help bring forward and not being talked over. Being able to say, stop, let me just repeat myself. I don’t think you heard me. It’s an okay thing to do. But again, it’s, it’s getting out of our comfort zone and not worrying about hurting feelings or wanting to be like those, those things we’ve got to push aside and really learned to kind of defend ourselves as we communicate in a respectful way.

Bill Russell:                   30:51               Yeah, it was interesting a couple of weeks ago, John Alaka pointed out that, uh, that, you know, the new cio is not somebody with a and he’s got an mit degree but not the most technical person in the group, but, but almost as sociologist and I, I pulled this and this is the second week in a row, I’m highlighting this story and I think it’s worth looking up. Korn ferry did a story, a breakthrough formula for women ceos and it’s worth a look and they had six qualities for a future ceos. And as I was reading this, I was thinking of a lot of NGOs comment, which is there is nothing distinctive, distinctively tactical or mail about these things. So it’s differentiating skills for future ceos, engages and inspires, develops talent, builds effective teams, directs works, has courage managers, ambiguity. And you know, when I talked to my two daughters and even my son and I, we talked about these things, I say you probably need something to start your career that you you’re really good at.

Bill Russell:                   31:54               And it could be accounting, engineering, could be tactical, but at some point what the organization needs more than anything is people that can rally people, inspire people, develop the next generation, build effective teams. And that’s a wide open game. And if you can develop those leadership skills, then you can actually progress. Even if you’re not the best engineer, you can progress into leadership roles and you shouldn’t consider yourself just because you’re not the best engineer not ready for leadership because you may have those skills and those qualities that we just rattle off a. I’ll let you

Jamie Nelson:               32:31               at my bio. You know, I have an Undergrad in humanities and a graduate degree in business. I am not a technician. My, my one coding courses basic that I took the cornell many, many years ago. So my leadership skills are much more around the things that you were just describing, which by the way are excellent skills for raising families. I might point out, uh, so yeah, I agree you, you, and especially for women than it leadership roles, you don’t have to be a technician. Men Do not have any, a technician. It’s about those other leadership qualities. So I think you’re completely correct there. I’d love to read that article. I’ll find it.

Bill Russell:                   33:09               This show really does go fast. We try to keep it to a half hour so that busy people like yourself and your staff can, can just pick it up and listen to it. So we are, we’re at the close. Here’s what we’re going to do. We always close with our favorite social media posts of the week and I’ll share mine. You can share your. So my, my post is from linkedin. It’s kind of Goofy, but it’s something that we all can relate to and it’s uh, it’s, it’s one of those videos and it has a gentleman sitting in on a hood of a car. The car is actually moving down the road and he’s actually in there working on the engine while it’s moving down the road and the caption says, fixing bugs after go live and any of us who’ve done these things and it’s, it’s, he’s really fixing the car, he students and stuff while it’s moved down the road and that we all know how that feels. So Jamie to you, I’ll let you close it out with your favorite posts

Jamie Nelson:               34:03               and um, I, I sent you the link so hopefully you can post it, but it was also from linkedin and it was about body language and communication I thought was a good ending to our discussion today because a very important how we communicate effectively. So great. Went to check out.

Bill Russell:                   34:19               That’s great. So, uh, so that’s all for now. Jamie, is there a way that people can. What’s the best way for people to follow you?

Jamie Nelson:               34:26               Uh, Linkedin, uh, so Jamie Nelson and I post things there. I can keep up with me and always they’ll feed. Finding here at hospital for special surgery.

Bill Russell:                   34:40               Sounds good. Also, you can, uh, you can follow me on twitter, the patient cio, my writing on health lyrics website and health system cio. Uh, don’t forget to follow show on twitter this week in health it or this week and hit and check out our new website this week in health And if you want to catch some of our videos, we launched a youtube channel. Is now has a close to 70 videos out there, that little snippets from each one of the shows and you can get to that. The easiest way to get to that is this week in health And, uh, if you get a chance to leave a leave a review for us, that would be greatly appreciated. Please come back every Friday for more news, information and a merchant thought from a industry influencers. Thank you very much. That’s all for now.


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